It is not the majority opinion.
However,
I do hold to that position because extensive study into his associations with the herods, as well as the Greek texts show strong reason of proof against him in multiple books.
That's fair. I've spent alot of time studying the history of Christianity, history of Israel, and in comparing the scriptures to the new testament, and what secular scholars teach, I saw a huge disconnect.
When digging into the history of the texts, and the history of denominations at the time, it became obvious where Paul stood in the matter of christianity. What's more is what Josephus said and the relationship of Paul to the herodians, pharisees, and platonic scholars of the time
Hey! Wow, that's a great question! I'm new here, and I'm still asking questions myself. The things that led you here, probably are the same that led me. Differences between Paul's teachings and those of Christ gave me pause. All the books are suspect to me.
From what I can gather, there are many books by attributed to Paul, that probably are not from him, but some are accepted as authentic--like Romans I believe.
So, right there, that tells me that someone was 'massaging' the message imho.
I think anyone standing up and claiming a new message from G__ is by definition a heretic. Including Jesus maybe. I personally put a lot of stock in the Gospel of Thomas, and I think Jesus was counting on that being clear to anyone who accepted his teaching.
Gospel of Thomas saying (21)
(1) Mary said to Jesus: “Whom are your disciples like?”
(2) He said: “They are like servants who are entrusted with a field that is not theirs.
(3) When the owners of the field arrive, they will say: ‘Let us have our field.’
(4) (But) they are naked in their presence so as to let them have it, (and thus) to give them their field.”
That being sad, because of the many 'various other authors' of Paul's letters, I'm not sure what Paul's teaching is. I might look at ONLY the FOR SURE known books that Paul authored and come up with an outline for my own interest.
If I don't like something, I don't really talk about it much. ie., Once I realized that Christ's message was real, I didn't see eye to with Paul, so I just stopped reading him. I bet he's blessed A LOT of people though. All the authors of Paul's letters. We might not be having this discussion if he hadn't.
Maybe G__ grafted him in 'various authors' and all. I'm open for anything. I think G__ might be bigger than we can imagine.
I know who Sha'ul was. 35 years I've been researching. It just disturbs me greatly how his words are being twisted. The man was a Torah advocate. The only Epistle that I've had a lot of doubts about it's authenticity in cannon is Hebrews.
I believe that Paul should be read VERY carefully. If anything he says goes against any of the rest of scripture I don’t give that portion much weight. I have believed for some time that Yahuah put a Deuteronomy 13 test right in His own Word. Will we disregard Him because of what a man says, to try us to see if it is really in our hearts to obey Him. If we have love for The Truth. There are plenty of things he says that are good, and many that at least “seem” to contradict, both himself and the rest of scripture. I have not completely thrown him out, but I read those books with MUCH discretion.
The issues I have is the fact that he himself had a very questionable background, and his doctrines were the foundation of Christian Gnosticism.
If any credit is given to him, the same needs to be given to the other sects of christianity that followed him.
If someone's words are twisted into something else, they aren't to blame for it. Nevertheless, there is some reason to believe that before his conversion that he was a member of the Mystery Schools. Before his conversion.
I'm personally on the fence about it, and no, I don't believe the majority of people who have accounts for this forum believe Paul is a heretic, but it would seem (to me) a hand full of the most active users on here do hold that particular belief.
Thank you all for the responses. It's not easy to respond to such a question knowing that you might be harassed for speaking what you believe.
That being said, I'm quite firm in my understanding of Paul. I've been reading his writings for three and a half decades. Paul was a stout advocate of Torah, and it disturbs me greatly to see his writings twisted, but Peter and other early believers were careful to warn us that such things would occur, just like I believe they warned us of the coming cult of Christianity which even then was beginning to infiltrate the body in such forms as the Nicolaitans.
I can "live with it", to an extent. I myself have been pushed to the corner, so to speak for merely stating that I don't put the Epistles on the same level of importance as I do Torah, the rest of the Tanach, the Gospels, Acts, and Revelation.
Not everyone does.
Is that the majority opinion here, in your opinion, Kristan? (TY for responding, btw).
It is not the majority opinion. However, I do hold to that position because extensive study into his associations with the herods, as well as the Greek texts show strong reason of proof against him in multiple books.
Thank you for clarifying. I've only met 2 people on here who would disagree with you on that, and one of them has already left the forums.
That's fair. I've spent alot of time studying the history of Christianity, history of Israel, and in comparing the scriptures to the new testament, and what secular scholars teach, I saw a huge disconnect. When digging into the history of the texts, and the history of denominations at the time, it became obvious where Paul stood in the matter of christianity. What's more is what Josephus said and the relationship of Paul to the herodians, pharisees, and platonic scholars of the time
Hey! Wow, that's a great question! I'm new here, and I'm still asking questions myself. The things that led you here, probably are the same that led me. Differences between Paul's teachings and those of Christ gave me pause. All the books are suspect to me.
From what I can gather, there are many books by attributed to Paul, that probably are not from him, but some are accepted as authentic--like Romans I believe.
So, right there, that tells me that someone was 'massaging' the message imho.
I think anyone standing up and claiming a new message from G__ is by definition a heretic. Including Jesus maybe. I personally put a lot of stock in the Gospel of Thomas, and I think Jesus was counting on that being clear to anyone who accepted his teaching.
Gospel of Thomas saying (21)
(1) Mary said to Jesus: “Whom are your disciples like?” (2) He said: “They are like servants who are entrusted with a field that is not theirs. (3) When the owners of the field arrive, they will say: ‘Let us have our field.’ (4) (But) they are naked in their presence so as to let them have it, (and thus) to give them their field.”
That being sad, because of the many 'various other authors' of Paul's letters, I'm not sure what Paul's teaching is. I might look at ONLY the FOR SURE known books that Paul authored and come up with an outline for my own interest.
If I don't like something, I don't really talk about it much. ie., Once I realized that Christ's message was real, I didn't see eye to with Paul, so I just stopped reading him. I bet he's blessed A LOT of people though. All the authors of Paul's letters. We might not be having this discussion if he hadn't.
Maybe G__ grafted him in 'various authors' and all. I'm open for anything. I think G__ might be bigger than we can imagine.
Great question! Makes me want to research now.
Be blessed.
PG
Greetings,
I know who Sha'ul was. 35 years I've been researching. It just disturbs me greatly how his words are being twisted. The man was a Torah advocate. The only Epistle that I've had a lot of doubts about it's authenticity in cannon is Hebrews.
I believe that Paul should be read VERY carefully. If anything he says goes against any of the rest of scripture I don’t give that portion much weight. I have believed for some time that Yahuah put a Deuteronomy 13 test right in His own Word. Will we disregard Him because of what a man says, to try us to see if it is really in our hearts to obey Him. If we have love for The Truth. There are plenty of things he says that are good, and many that at least “seem” to contradict, both himself and the rest of scripture. I have not completely thrown him out, but I read those books with MUCH discretion.
The issues I have is the fact that he himself had a very questionable background, and his doctrines were the foundation of Christian Gnosticism. If any credit is given to him, the same needs to be given to the other sects of christianity that followed him.
If someone's words are twisted into something else, they aren't to blame for it. Nevertheless, there is some reason to believe that before his conversion that he was a member of the Mystery Schools. Before his conversion.
I'm personally on the fence about it, and no, I don't believe the majority of people who have accounts for this forum believe Paul is a heretic, but it would seem (to me) a hand full of the most active users on here do hold that particular belief.
I belive that Paul is heretic. His writtings kept me away from bible 40 years
No one can keep you from Scripture. Only you can do that.
There is no one here who can speak for nearly everyone. 😃
Well said, Phillip.
Thank you all for the responses. It's not easy to respond to such a question knowing that you might be harassed for speaking what you believe.
That being said, I'm quite firm in my understanding of Paul. I've been reading his writings for three and a half decades. Paul was a stout advocate of Torah, and it disturbs me greatly to see his writings twisted, but Peter and other early believers were careful to warn us that such things would occur, just like I believe they warned us of the coming cult of Christianity which even then was beginning to infiltrate the body in such forms as the Nicolaitans.
I can "live with it", to an extent. I myself have been pushed to the corner, so to speak for merely stating that I don't put the Epistles on the same level of importance as I do Torah, the rest of the Tanach, the Gospels, Acts, and Revelation.
Woul somebody explain me what means next ABC soup Imho? Ie? Thank you ☺